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Thread: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

  1. #1
    Anodized. Again. Konrad's Avatar
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    Default Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    I know TBCS isn't really a hardcore OC site. Though it seems to be a common enough topic that maybe it should have it's own subforum? (And if it already does then I'm sorry for misposting this thread here, lol.)

    I used to avidly overclock back in the P4-era but I eventually just sort of lost interest (rated specs work well enough for most of my use so OC tinkering and hassles haven't been worth the effort) ... so I'm kind of way behind on how things are done these days. I've recently become interested again and I've been reading up (extensively). It looks like a few things have changed but the basic ideas and methods are still the same.

    Questions:

    1) I've recently learned about flashing DIMM firmware. Obviously you can break your RAM stick. Especially if you're dumb and try to increase to non-existent memory capacity. And you probably can't get any real gains in timing or voltage (unless you're really lucky) because the chips are already binned and matched at the factory. I suppose you can change the SPD defaults to allow the RAM to work as desired for mobos which don't provide BIOS SPD configuration options ... but otherwise, is there any purpose for doing this? Are there tricks I don't know about?

    2) It appears that you can't overclock mobo (G)MCH, ICH, or Super I/O chips. Yeah, this carries a fairly high risk of killing the mobo. And screwing with the ICH or I/O timings can cause all sorts of problems interfacing with any hardware you plug in.
    But the MCH is a slightly different matter. The way I see it, processors and adapter cards are often OC'd, or simply upgraded ... yet the MCH isn't. Ever. In fact, it's often a bottleneck (when DMI/QPI gets saturated) and PCIe adapters routinely use bridges to bypass it entirely. I hear that Win7 OS (and new software to run on it) attempts to somehow optimize processor/cache use to - again - reduce QPI traffic across the mobo ... though I'm a little hazy on how this might be done or if it really works.
    Yes, any decent BIOS will allow you to change the mobo's FSB frequency (133MHz+) and sometimes a few other bus timings (PCIe, PCI, USB, etc). But you apparently cannot change the mobo voltage.
    Looking closely at a couple of my mobos I see that the MCH is serviced by plenty of voltage regulators ... just not as robust or reconfigurable as the processor VRM, obviously because the part is permanently mounted so fixed voltages will suffice. I wonder if gains can be made (after a little mobo part modification, lol) by increasing the MCH voltage a notch or two? Would this help increase data rates across things like the PCIe/HDD/USB busses, or even integrated graphics performance? Yes, I notice that the part can already get hot when busy, so obviously a cooling upgrade would also be required.

    I also notice that each main component of the chipset has it's own firmware, and it's own version/revision levels, stepping, etc. Can any of these be reflashed? Would flashing sessions be more complex than just running software (ie, attaching some hardware, requiring another working computer/device, etc)?
    (I've read through a few datasheets and it seems that this sort of information just isn't published in the public domain, just wondering if people have already done this, how, and with what results.)
    My mind says Technic, but my body says Duplo.

  2. #2
    Resident 100HP water-cannon operator SXRguyinMA's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    my Asus P5E Deluxe allows changing of almost all the voltages


  3. #3
    Mentally Underclocked mDust's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Wait for Krazy Kayin to see this. If anyone here has tried this it would be him.

    OCing the PCIe, PCI, or USB bus would be counterproductive. The headaches outweigh the gains by a large margin. And more often than not, devices that interface with these will not work properly if the timings do not match...good luck OCing all of your devices to match the bus.

    Flashing DIMM firmware sounds experimental at best. I would think manufacturers match their memory with the highest clock speeds possible so they can sell the memory at a higher price. I'm not sure what gains are there to be had, but it's likely that the gain to risk ratio is heavily skewed out of your favor. That doesn't mean it's not fun though!

    EDIT:
    BTW, these aren't noob questions, they're pretty damn advanced. A noob question would be 'Hey guys, how do I get to the bios screen again?'
    I'll procrastinate tomorrow.

  4. #4
    Anodized. Again. Konrad's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Quote Originally Posted by SXRguyinMA
    my Asus P5E Deluxe allows changing of almost all the voltages
    That's a kickass BIOS, gotta love Asus.

    Are there any substantial differences between BIOS brands (Phoenix/Award, AMI)? Overall I mean, not board-specific. I've never seen NB/SB voltage controls. I don't even know what FSB Termination voltage is, lol, or the difference between vCore and PLL voltages (on a PC, anyhow). "Ai Clock Twister" ... is that some kind of frequency spectrum setting (used to reduce EMI for regulatory compliance)?
    My mind says Technic, but my body says Duplo.

  5. #5
    Overclocking Guru Trace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Just wait until you see the review of the mobo I have from Gigabyte. It has every option I could dream of.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lothair View Post
    I guess it's just widely used and has had some of the best people in the world work on it, costing a ridiculous amount of money, for no actual reason. :/
    Have you checked out the front page lately?
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    Custom Title Honors Snowman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Trace View Post
    Just wait until you see the review of the mobo I have from Gigabyte. It has every option I could dream of.
    Bet it doesn't have go to the kitchen and make me a sammich.
    Regedit'ed, Rooted, and Jailbroke anymore questions?
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    woy...collokweee...weeble weeble blaaaat artoodeeto's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowman View Post
    Bet it doesn't have go to the kitchen and make me a sammich.
    No, for that you need a "mother, bored." (sorry...couldn't resist...)
    Quote Originally Posted by ElevateThis View Post
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    (Steam me.... that sounds bad >_<)

  8. #8
    Custom Title Honors Snowman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Quote Originally Posted by artoodeeto View Post
    No, for that you need a "mother, bored." (sorry...couldn't resist...)
    repped
    Regedit'ed, Rooted, and Jailbroke anymore questions?
    Here’s a bumper sticker I’d like to see: “We are the proud parents of a child who’s self-esteem is sufficient that he doesn’t need us promoting his minor scholastic achievements on the back of our car.”

  9. #9
    One Eye, Sixteen Cores. Kayin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Sorry this languished. I made a few Classified BIOSes and have mucked about with 790FX on that side, but short of reflashing SPD timings, not much to be gained. Get a good board that has good BIOS support (third of first party, no diff really) and it's really getting easier overall.

    As for SuperIO and other such chips, there are a few black artists out there, but it's negligible performance. Look at the new AMD and Intel chips with integrated memory controllers and integrated PCI-E for what you can REALLY do to some of the interconnects.
    Project:Mithril, sponsored by Petra's Tech Shop and Sidewinder Computers-MOTM Nominee October '08




  10. #10
    Resident 100HP water-cannon operator SXRguyinMA's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kinda noob Overclocking questions

    Hey Kayin, seeing how you seem to know a lot about this stuff, I've got an older ECS mobo (Athlon XP socket) that has 3-pin fan headers, but no control over the fan speeds whatsoever in the BIOS. Is this something I could flash in a different BIOS and at least have control over (not thermal, but at least be able to go into BIOS and set the fans to say 40% or 50%, rather than having them screaming at 100% all the time?

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